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Author Topic: Presenting '90MSM!  (Read 179337 times)
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mr_hyde
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Midlife Crisis on Wheels!


« Reply #360 on: July 24, 2014, 05:56:59 AM »

Have you had a chance to evaluate the location of the oil cooler and how the removal of the radiator fan impacts your water temps?

For the record, I'm thrilled with this oil cooler configuration.  A street car wouldn't want to lose the second fan but for the track car, it is an extremely simple setup with no complicated ducting.  The temps on track last week seemed to be holding a steady 210* which is perfect for oil IMO.   afro
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2005 Black Mica #290 8/27/04 w/Factory Hard Top
BEGi Intake, FM Downpipe.  Nice and calm with an edge...

1990 Red - MSM Drivetrain, Adaptronic EMS, Xida 700/400, 15x9 6uls, Full Cage, SGDP w/80mm Corksport exhaust, ~260whp @ 15psi on Forged Rods.  bow2
Build Thread: http://www.mazda-speed.com/forum2/index.php/topic,24668.0.html

2000 BMW M5 - The Falcon - Daily Driver  reddevil

2003 E350 7.3 Powerstroke Ambulance for towing '90MSM to play dates.

1991 BRG - Daughter's daily driver.
Lokiel
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« Reply #361 on: July 24, 2014, 07:43:52 AM »

Thanks for the update.
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Ti Aussie "SE" (cannot be called "MazdaSpeed" here, "speed/performance" badging encourages reckless driving apparently), DIY AutoTune MS3-Pro ECU, Borg-Warner EFR6258, NitroDann custom manifold+3"exhaust+CAI, Injector Dynamics 1000cc injectors, GM D514A CNPs, 83.5mm coated CP pistons, K1 rods, Fab9 350HP intercooler,  ported Squaretop Intake Manifold, Skunk2 Throttle Body, ATi Super Damper, '95MSM SpeedHut Boost Gauge Mod, GREDDY Remote Oil Filter Relocation with Thermostat, Setrab Oil Cooler, BC Racing BR Series coilovers (8/6kg), 1.125" Racing Beat Tubular Sway Bar + Al Braces, 949racing SuperMiata end links, Carbing 3-pt shock tower brace, Nickel 6UL 15x8s, Toyo R1Rs 225/45/15, Wilwood Front BBK, SS Brake Lines, FM Frame Rails, Boss Frog "Frog Arms", MX5 Plus Twin Hoop Roll Bar, MiataRoadster long-angled SSK, Piano-Black Voodoo Knob&HandBrake, Innovate MTX-L Wideband O2 gauge+sensor, Lotus Probax seats + lots of "goes faster" chrome bling (since chrome reflects light, less of the colour spectrum is absorbed, making the car lighter - "pseudo-science" Smiley ).
Build Thread: http://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=41091
mr_hyde
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Midlife Crisis on Wheels!


« Reply #362 on: September 23, 2014, 06:11:03 AM »

The car is getting pretty quick these days.  I had a fun two-day at Mazda Raceway Laguna Seca with a couple of thousand other miatas and just got back from Oregon Raceway park last night.  The oil temps have been mostly kept in check but with ambient temps above 80 at ORP this weekend, I was seeing oil temps ~240* with water around 210*.  There were two money shifts at MRLS and I'm pretty certain I bent an intake valve or two.  I'm also not convinced the rings are as tight as they were when the motor was fresh.  There is a fair amount of smoke too...  A teardown is in order for the winter but I'm hopeful I can get one more double weekend out it!

I've been experimenting with brakes a bit starting at MRLS.  The old setup of XP12 front/rear was going through pads pretty quickly and not as balanced as I would like.  I went to XP24s in the front for Laguna and they are pretty awesome.  With a heat rage of 400*-2,000*f, they take a bit of time to get heat in them but the grip is astonishing.  I seemed to be out braking everyone and the pads seem to actually like being abused.  I ate up the 12s in the rear at Laguna and had to put on a set of used emergency pads for Sunday.  I ate those too and had to put a used mystery compound for ORP Sunday.  I haven't checked how they did but the braking was once again epic.  ORP is hard on brakes so I'm curious to go check.  XP8s are on order for the rear which should provide a better balance.

The transmission synchros are starting to crunch a bit in 3rd and 4th so I'm going to try a cocktail my buddy John has been using - one quart of Redline MT and one quart of light shockproof.

Here are videos from MRLS and ORP. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15QdHPULc9A&list=UUWmFKe7puUGsXFsknSLhYRA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjVDbxUXRHY&list=UUWmFKe7puUGsXFsknSLhYRA
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2005 Black Mica #290 8/27/04 w/Factory Hard Top
BEGi Intake, FM Downpipe.  Nice and calm with an edge...

1990 Red - MSM Drivetrain, Adaptronic EMS, Xida 700/400, 15x9 6uls, Full Cage, SGDP w/80mm Corksport exhaust, ~260whp @ 15psi on Forged Rods.  bow2
Build Thread: http://www.mazda-speed.com/forum2/index.php/topic,24668.0.html

2000 BMW M5 - The Falcon - Daily Driver  reddevil

2003 E350 7.3 Powerstroke Ambulance for towing '90MSM to play dates.

1991 BRG - Daughter's daily driver.
SilverMiataRacer
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« Reply #363 on: September 23, 2014, 10:48:26 AM »

Your going to run 24 in the front and 8 in the back???  Seems like a pretty big spread to me?  I was running 20 in the front and 10 in the back on the Z06 and had to change to 20 and 12 to even the braking a bit.
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Larry

4 Miatas but who's counting!!   Cool

White Knight    1991 Crystal White   #99 CSP
Silver Bullet     1992 Silverstone     #17 SM2  FM I+ Turbo  (Gone but not forgotten)
Honey B          1992 Sunburst Yellow #99 SM2 J.R. M45
Whooosh         2004 Titanium MazdaSpeed MX5  #403 of 4000
Subie              2006 Steel Gray WRX STi Cobb Stage 2 (Gone but not forgotten)
No name yet    2008 Velocity Yellow Tintcoat Z06 Corvette
No Name yet    2014 Ashen Grey Metallic Camaro 2SS 1LE

“There are only three sports: mountain climbing, bull fighting, and motor racing. All the rest are merely games.”
– Ernest Hemingway
chance91
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OK!


« Reply #364 on: September 23, 2014, 03:39:43 PM »

Had to drop by and see what this "extra engine" you were building was for.  Looks like you properly flog the heck out of your car.  Looking forward to the new MSM motor2.0. 

Cheers,

Nick afro
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2005 MazdaSpeed Miata #927 

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04TitaniumGrayPhilly
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« Reply #365 on: September 23, 2014, 04:35:47 PM »

I love the location of the oil cooler. I presume that's with the lines that come with the FM kit? I would have never thought to put it there. My TSE radiator doesn't have the connections to mount it there however  Sad
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2004 Mazdaspeed Miata #2373 - 328whp and 308wtq/ 2500lbs
ARTech, EFR6258, XIDA, Maxxis RC-1, 3.63 R&P
mr_hyde
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Midlife Crisis on Wheels!


« Reply #366 on: September 24, 2014, 04:32:07 AM »

I talked to Sonny and Emilio for a while on this and they agreed that XP12s were providing too much rear bias and were probably not heating up completely.  This weekend I used some used 'mystery' pads which I think were probably XP8 and I really liked how they felt. 

Chance91 - I need to refresh the motor this winter and thought it might be a good time to build a full longblock with forged pistons.  Your spare box of parts could come in handy! 

Philly - I made the hoses for the cooler myself.  They are -10 where the FM lines are -8.  I like it overall but it did get a bit hotter than I liked Sunday (~240*) although the water was closer to ~210*.
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2005 Black Mica #290 8/27/04 w/Factory Hard Top
BEGi Intake, FM Downpipe.  Nice and calm with an edge...

1990 Red - MSM Drivetrain, Adaptronic EMS, Xida 700/400, 15x9 6uls, Full Cage, SGDP w/80mm Corksport exhaust, ~260whp @ 15psi on Forged Rods.  bow2
Build Thread: http://www.mazda-speed.com/forum2/index.php/topic,24668.0.html

2000 BMW M5 - The Falcon - Daily Driver  reddevil

2003 E350 7.3 Powerstroke Ambulance for towing '90MSM to play dates.

1991 BRG - Daughter's daily driver.
SilverMiataRacer
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« Reply #367 on: September 24, 2014, 10:24:25 AM »

Did your mystery pads still have color on the backing plates?  I have the color chart somewhere for Carbotechs.


Found it, It's pre XP24 so if you can tell me the color of them I'll add it to the list.

« Last Edit: September 24, 2014, 10:32:20 AM by SilverMiataRacer » Logged

Larry

4 Miatas but who's counting!!   Cool

White Knight    1991 Crystal White   #99 CSP
Silver Bullet     1992 Silverstone     #17 SM2  FM I+ Turbo  (Gone but not forgotten)
Honey B          1992 Sunburst Yellow #99 SM2 J.R. M45
Whooosh         2004 Titanium MazdaSpeed MX5  #403 of 4000
Subie              2006 Steel Gray WRX STi Cobb Stage 2 (Gone but not forgotten)
No name yet    2008 Velocity Yellow Tintcoat Z06 Corvette
No Name yet    2014 Ashen Grey Metallic Camaro 2SS 1LE

“There are only three sports: mountain climbing, bull fighting, and motor racing. All the rest are merely games.”
– Ernest Hemingway
mr_hyde
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Fifth Gear
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Posts: 7213


Midlife Crisis on Wheels!


« Reply #368 on: September 24, 2014, 04:30:29 PM »

Did your mystery pads still have color on the backing plates?  

I seem to remember the XP24 pads being green like the RP2 but as a general rule, all of the brake pads on '90MSM have been on fire at some point so the original color is impossible to determine.   After a good day at the track the color of the backing plate is ash gray...  laugh laugh laugh
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2005 Black Mica #290 8/27/04 w/Factory Hard Top
BEGi Intake, FM Downpipe.  Nice and calm with an edge...

1990 Red - MSM Drivetrain, Adaptronic EMS, Xida 700/400, 15x9 6uls, Full Cage, SGDP w/80mm Corksport exhaust, ~260whp @ 15psi on Forged Rods.  bow2
Build Thread: http://www.mazda-speed.com/forum2/index.php/topic,24668.0.html

2000 BMW M5 - The Falcon - Daily Driver  reddevil

2003 E350 7.3 Powerstroke Ambulance for towing '90MSM to play dates.

1991 BRG - Daughter's daily driver.
04TitaniumGrayPhilly
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« Reply #369 on: September 24, 2014, 06:57:11 PM »

I talked to Sonny and Emilio for a while on this and they agreed that XP12s were providing too much rear bias and were probably not heating up completely.  This weekend I used some used 'mystery' pads which I think were probably XP8 and I really liked how they felt. 

Chance91 - I need to refresh the motor this winter and thought it might be a good time to build a full longblock with forged pistons.  Your spare box of parts could come in handy! 

Philly - I made the hoses for the cooler myself.  They are -10 where the FM lines are -8.  I like it overall but it did get a bit hotter than I liked Sunday (~240*) although the water was closer to ~210*.
There's probably a way to mount it in front of the radiator but behind the FMIC, in the AC core area. That would be a stretch, but might get better airflow. That's where the PS cooler on my car is. I don't mind the FM location for it, but it would be nice if the brackets were angled up a bit more to keep it off the ground. I've got a small dent on the corner of mine so I know it's seen something.
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2004 Mazdaspeed Miata #2373 - 328whp and 308wtq/ 2500lbs
ARTech, EFR6258, XIDA, Maxxis RC-1, 3.63 R&P
chance91
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« Reply #370 on: September 25, 2014, 09:38:15 AM »

I managed to remove the oem LOL-power steering cooler loop, and re-use those mounts for my own unit.  I made them double duty, they held my inter cooler and my power steering cooler both.  you could do the same with oil/power steering or other variations.  Worked well for me, may be worth messing around with.
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2005 MazdaSpeed Miata #927 

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mr_hyde
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Midlife Crisis on Wheels!


« Reply #371 on: September 25, 2014, 09:14:37 PM »

I was going for a few different things with that placement:

1.  I wanted easy routing for the hoses - less length is less resistance in flow and less places to rub on things.
2.  My sandwich plate doesn't have thermostat so I wanted the cooler to preheat where possible and also avoid overcooling in cold temperatures.
3.  I wanted to be able to see the fitting to be able to watch for leaks.
4.  Didn't want to punch additional holes in the front and/or deal with additional ducting.
5.  Wanted the cooler to be relatively protected from track debris or minor impacts.

This winter, I'm going to seal between the radiator and oil cooler to force a bit more air through the oil cooler.  ~240* was the hottest oil I saw all season and that was with >80* ambient which is on the warm side for us.  I just checked the datalog from the weekend and the water topped out at 208* and the intake air at the throttle body was 135* and I am very happy with both of those numbers...  afro
Logged

2005 Black Mica #290 8/27/04 w/Factory Hard Top
BEGi Intake, FM Downpipe.  Nice and calm with an edge...

1990 Red - MSM Drivetrain, Adaptronic EMS, Xida 700/400, 15x9 6uls, Full Cage, SGDP w/80mm Corksport exhaust, ~260whp @ 15psi on Forged Rods.  bow2
Build Thread: http://www.mazda-speed.com/forum2/index.php/topic,24668.0.html

2000 BMW M5 - The Falcon - Daily Driver  reddevil

2003 E350 7.3 Powerstroke Ambulance for towing '90MSM to play dates.

1991 BRG - Daughter's daily driver.
04TitaniumGrayPhilly
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« Reply #372 on: September 25, 2014, 10:06:40 PM »

I assumed you had the FM kit with the thermo plate. The FM location is good if you have a protective shield there. Iirc someone made a scoop for their FM cooler. I'll be watching this.
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2004 Mazdaspeed Miata #2373 - 328whp and 308wtq/ 2500lbs
ARTech, EFR6258, XIDA, Maxxis RC-1, 3.63 R&P
mr_hyde
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Midlife Crisis on Wheels!


« Reply #373 on: September 25, 2014, 10:45:55 PM »

The FM placement was interfering with my splitter and I wanted bungs in my sandwich plate for a pressure switch and temperature sender.  I also wanted a larger heat exchanger with more volume with -10 hoses and fittings.  The FM kit is great for a street car or dual purpose track day toys but I beat on '90MSM more than most MSMs that are taken to the track.   afro
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2005 Black Mica #290 8/27/04 w/Factory Hard Top
BEGi Intake, FM Downpipe.  Nice and calm with an edge...

1990 Red - MSM Drivetrain, Adaptronic EMS, Xida 700/400, 15x9 6uls, Full Cage, SGDP w/80mm Corksport exhaust, ~260whp @ 15psi on Forged Rods.  bow2
Build Thread: http://www.mazda-speed.com/forum2/index.php/topic,24668.0.html

2000 BMW M5 - The Falcon - Daily Driver  reddevil

2003 E350 7.3 Powerstroke Ambulance for towing '90MSM to play dates.

1991 BRG - Daughter's daily driver.
schmoo
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« Reply #374 on: September 29, 2014, 01:43:09 PM »

New oil cooler mounted in place of the second fan.

Glowshift sandwich plate with bungs for the oil pressure switch and oil temperature.  The temp sender is on the way to the cooler and the pressure switch is on the way back from the cooler.  If I lose an oil line, the pressure light will go off a second or two before the sump goes dry.  I can't recall how the BP motor is plumbed but putting the pressure switch closest to the most likely point of failure makes sense to me.   afro


The cooler is just mounted to the bungs on the radiator where the fans would normally mount.  The sandwich plate doesn't have a t-stat so the cooler located behind the radiator will help it come to temperature and not overcool.  I wouldn't run a street car like this but it will work fine on '90MSM.

Do you find that the cooler drains itself when you're changing the oil? As in you don't have to undo all the fittings?

I'd like to mount mine such that it self drains. I'll refill it by cranking without fuel/spark to build some pressure before starting.

N
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Driver-Limited Canadian 2004 MSM Track Toy in Velocity Red | FM Big Enchilada w/Hydra 2.7, FM AFCO Coilovers, 15x9 6UL Gen2 & Advanti Storm, FM Anti-Roll Bars, Carbotech Pads, FM SS Lines, FM Racing Rad, FM Oil Cooler, Momo Lesmo One Seat, Schroth Profi 2 Harness, HDHCDD M2 Hardtop with Harness Bar, AiM MXL Pro with Smartycam HD GP, Gutted Interior
[img width= height= alt=" border="0]http://www.uncommonpear.com/wp-content/uploads/avatars-signatures/IMG_5971-2-2.jpg[/img]
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